Well lemme ask ya this RC....and les...just how much "research' have you actually done on it?
Do you know all the "arguments"....have you read all the info available from both sides?
Geez les where did the illuminati come from....lol
Anyway RC yeah sure current global temps are rising no doubt about that...bit more to it than that tho.
RC my politician comment was a lil toungue-in-cheek....just a lil tho....I know some "good" ones'....I was refering more to the system they operate under than any particular individual...overall tho...well....draw ur own conlclusions....and do some research....sorry could'nt resist...lol
There is much inherent misunderstanding within a communication environmemt such as this.
Like everything else it has advantages and disadvantages.
I would love to have the gentleness and insight of missbliss...and maybe one day I will.
To be able to post and express a view without ever offending anyone is surely an enlightended soul.
Meanwhile...that isn't the current reality here or anywhere else...apart from a few.
Seeing this is a bit of a backwater on the forum I'm gonna take the liberty of expressing some views I choose not to express elsewhere.
If any offence is taken it is surely not intended...just how i see things at my current level of awareness. Right or wrong.
And I warn you i shall speak frankly...you know where the "X" button is.
I have to talk about "me" because it is the only current reference point I have.
When i talk to people face-to-face i am genuinley interested in that person...their views...their life experiences. I am rarely interested in expressing my views. Of course on here it would seem the opposite but in reality 90% of the time I just "listen". If a conversation or connection evolves then yes I will engage that person on a "deeper" level.
Sincerely listening to anothers views is to me a form of love and compassion.
I tend to question strongly held views...not to be contentious....not for the sake of argument or debate but to learn. To learn about why that person holds such strong views. To learn how they came about holding those views. It is my experience though that many people don't really know why they hold some views...they are simply "adopted" because it suits what they choose to believe or what "resonates" with them at any given point in time in their own "evolution".
Not saying that's a bad thing by default, because some adopted views could be more beneficial to self and others than some "other" views. It's all relative.
Rowdy....I really hope you haven't departed the forum. Your input is too valuable to lose.
Sometimes love and compassion involves things that we really don't want to get involved in. It's just way easier to ignore it all...but is that love and compassion in action?
When i was involved in a relationship that involved kids (they were not mine)...it would have been way easier to simply ignore things that needed to be dealt with...."he who does not discipline his child does not love his child".....so from a stance of love and compassion and care for another you step up to the plate and do the "hard yards"...is that not love and compassion in action?
Is it not for the benefit of others that sometimes hard yards have be to run?
As i said to Daniel once (one of the kids)...would you rather be "disciplined" by me (from love) or "disciplined" by life (a much harder and non-caring "disciplinarian") ?
Some have taken "offence" by what they see as an 'attack" by me on Harley.
Well sorry....but I find it difficult to sit back and watch while heaps of people have left this forum because of his mode of expression. While i do respect harleys passion and the fact he does indeed walk his talk in my opinion [and I have stated this publicly many times] his approach to it causes more damage than good....and I've said so...many times.
Frankly I find much of his approach self-serving. I think harley could do a tremendous amount of good to his own cause and beliefs if he changed his slant a tad.
He's been "told" time and time again...by many people...including the current and previous owners of this forum. Yet nothing has really changed. I can only personally draw one conclusion from that...you draw your own....
When one person with so much passion, knowledge and insight can cause so much damage to the cause they proclaim to promote...well....I've drawn my own conclusions....you draw your own.
While promoting the raw vegan lifestyle and it's benefits and sustainabilty and living from unemployment benefits...benefits provided by the very lifestyle he derides...well I dunno about you...but to me that dilutes his message.
On a more postiive note Les (fbi) and I have/are considering "funding" and doing perhaps a documentary on Harley and maybe a few others from here...to get him off the dole...if he can provide some substantive evidence of the benefit of his lifestyle. So is that an "attack" on Harls....hardly.....
I realise that many souls on here are very gentle and loving people who abhor any kind of "conrontation"....but I say to you...that sometimes in life confrontation is inevitable.
Not confrontation for the mere sake of it....but confrontation to at least attempt to resolve an "issue".
It's very easy to just sit back and be a tad "judgemental" about anyone who chooses to engage themsleves in possible confrontation while you sit there drinking green smoothies and wishing the world was a better place.
Sometimes like it or not you just have to step up to the plate.
I'm pretty sure....given the "right" circumstances (for you as an individual) that you would all "step up to the plate" if necessary....
I'm "heading towards" it's practice missbliss...just seems to resonate within me for a long time (since reading Yoganadas autobiography many decades back).
I agree Rudy....rowdy made me think as well....wise rowdy that he/she is....
Still...the pack notion grates on me...it implies an intent I never personally held.
More like you the things I have said were more from a "protective" stance than an inate desire or "necessity" to "attack" anyone.
I just got sooooo frustrated when I received so many private messages from so many people who for whatever reason didn't want to "stand up" and say what they thought....from fear of being attacked from a 'pack" that already existed....and I'm talking a lotta people here....
Did I do the wrong thing or the right thing?
I dunno...ultimately...it sure felt like the right thing to do though.
I left the forum because of it.
Time out called the ref.
Then here i was still lurking and gaining from some incredible people and offering nothing back...I felt like a parasite...so I came back....
Rowdy I love you dearly...but I don't always agree with ya....and If I don't I'm gonna say so....is that a bad thing?
While I completely understand what you are saying and refering to rowdy....there's a few things that-that simplistic view doesn't take into account.
The burning desire as you put is not to hunt in a pack but to restore some balance.
How many people left rowdy?
I for one never hunted in any pack....I stood alone....I stood alone in support of others. The "pack" was from the "other side". You may disagree with that...on a number of levels and if you do I understand why.
Motive and intent can easily be misread...particularly over a small grouping of posts...but over thousands?
I wouldn't say this anywhere but in this journal (because I'm not ultimately looking fer support) but the fact is that the real "pack" support was obvious.
Is it wrong to stand up and speak?
It isn't a hunt....that's a flawed anology in my view...and one you have said to me once before..."alpha dog mentality"...if you believe that you miss the point.
Sometimes you have to stand up and be counted...sometimes you have to engage in situations that are contentious whether you like it or not..if it's done from compassion and love (for others) is it flawed?
Most certainly is if it's done fer purely self-serving reasons.
But....you be the judge...rowdy.
John
PS:...blow it....I aint finished just yet.
Consider this:
read back over a lotta posts from a certain crew and you see a grouping of similarities. One theme is how you look...your physical appearance.....it's highly rated and regarded....I personally consider that a very shallow view in the light of the way it has been repeatedly presented.
Another theme is the obvious self-serving continual reference to athletic prowess sprouted by a few very prolific posters.
How does any of this help the "average" Joe or Jane when by implication...obvious implication....if ya aint 100% raw 811 and look great and are an athlete ya aint even in the boat race.
Hi waterberry...had to read that a few times myself to digest it...nicely said.
Not for one second am I saying I have all the answers to anything...far from it. All i can do (any of us) is relate our views based on our unique experiences and perceptions...the more people that add to that pot the more we all learn...least that's how I see it.
I love this thread/journal....a nice lil backwater for the expression of views in 2008.
When I first started posting here Rudy and I had a few 'run-ins"...more from my side than his.
However over time I've grown to "love" and respect Rudy...even though we sometimes disagree or say the same things from different angles...it's all good....it's all good.
If harls can provide some "proof" of the benefits of his lifestyle in relation to curing illness then maybe you and I les can set him up in some kinda consultancy role and get him off the dole?
Just a thought....
That way he could be involved in a highly productive and interactive environment to help spread his truth?
Translation...I bet on horse races fer a living. Some would term that a "professional punter" or a "professional gambler"...a completely incorrect view of what I do though. I don't "gamble" I simply operate within a market that is gambling oriented.
Closest anology would be day trading on the stock market.
It's just another market.
The biggest difference between horse racing markets and day-trading-stock-market markets is that under current ATO rulings horse racing is indeed considered "gambling" and any income derived from such is non-taxable.
So basically (and currently) harley I don't contribute to your government handouts.
Pretty sure a lotta hard working folk on here do though.....
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